39 replies to this topic

[totalhum]

Can anyone explain why OE2.0 is not available for this reciever? (or very limited support)

 

Also - any chance to teach us how to compile a build for a clone reciever (sim 2.10).

 

Sorry for the stupid questions.

[Erik Slagter]

Can anyone explain why OE2.0 is not available for this reciever? (or very limited support)

OpenPLi is not OE2.0 or whatever OE version.

Also - any chance to teach us how to compile a build for a clone reciever (sim 2.10).

There is no support for clones whatsoever, anyway.

[totalhum]

Why is OPEN PLI affiliated to the OEM manufacturers??

[betacentauri]

I think this is one of the reasons:
http://openpli.org/f...ndpost&p=374917

But I'm not an OpenPli member.

[Erik Slagter]

Various reasons, the most important being that none of the members own a clone box (due to terrible quality) so we could never test the behaviour.

 

Besides that, don't you think yourself it's a bit "wrong" to buy a clone box?

[totalhum]

An 800 se was half the price with similair internal hardware. Dm really got the prices wrong on that one.

[littlesat]

That is true... but the clone boxes do not need to invest in driver devolopment as they simply use the DMM drivers.

Edited by littlesat, 22 September 2013 - 11:40.

[WanWizard]

Why is OPEN PLI affiliated to the OEM manufacturers??

 

OpenPLi is not affiliated with anyone. It is a matter of quality and support.

 

If you have a BMW, and something is wrong, you can go to your certified dealer and have it fixed. If it's a manufacturing issue, it will be fixed for free. If you have a chinese block of metal on wheels with a BMW badge, that dealer will not fix anything. The chinese manufacturer that made your BMW copy will not fix thing either. So your on your own.

 

Same applies to clone boxes. You bought a crap piece of hardware with hacked software on it. Live with the consequences.

[athoik]

You can buy an original receiver (like ET4000) with even fewer money than "clones DMM"!

 

Why stick with DMM? DMM is not listening.

 

People are asking for DTS, no response.

 

People are asking for DD+, no response.

 

DMM did lot of research though, others simply clone their code, ideas and payed the licenses to get DTS/DD+/etc into their drivers.

 

Others did not help Enigma2 either...

 

Did someone from Enigma2 (ventors) fix subservices?

Did someone fix Enigma2 (ventors) running out of memory with using popen?

 

Thats why (probably) DMM closed the source of Enigma2, because she tired giving ready food to others.

 

I would like to hear more opinions on this. But this is the idea i have in my mind currently.

 

PS. Currenlty almost everyone is cloping OpenPLi sources...

Edited by athoik, 22 September 2013 - 12:11.

[Erik Slagter]

DMM also needs to fix their drivers for newer kernels (memory fragmentation).

[Happysat]

Can anyone explain why OE2.0 is not available for this reciever? (or very limited support)

 

Also - any chance to teach us how to compile a build for a clone reciever (sim 2.10).

 

Sorry for the stupid questions.

 

 

Yes, the cloners are unable to break driver protection after dreambox-dvb-modules-2.6.18-7.4-20111109 which means they are all sticked to OE 1.6/Pli 2.1 builds, except the a8p owners.

Edited by Happysat, 22 September 2013 - 13:36.

[gorski]

My Ferrari 500HD is no cr@p HW, as suggested pretty aggressively by some on the forum a while back and as now repeated in various ways...

 

As anyone can see from various responses, DMM has shot themselves in the foot many a time and they deserved what they got!

 

I have just about had it with anyone defending m$, NDS, DMM and alike, the biggest pirates, hackers, plagiators on Earth...

 

Moreover, specifically DMM, have a history of destroying other people's property and so on...

 

Please, check your moral and intellectual compasses, for crying out loud...

[theparasol]

Even the name "Ferrari" is crap if you ask me

 

As even some original manufacturers cant produce stable drivers for their original equipment how and why should the openpli team support clone equipment relaying on those drivers.

 

A product involves far more than the cost of the plain hardware (!) 

[gorski]

Name OK or not - that is down to "liking" or not liking and all to their own...

 

HW of F500HD is NOT bad by any means, full stop! (The company also went into new original box and so on...)

 

But you're missing the wood for the trees...

 

Those clones are supported, indirectly. It is not possible not to. It's just that it is not debated... My "guide" for F500HD PBNIGMA, by the same token, also supports DMM500HD.

 

We are all involved, one way or another. But that does not necessarily mean something bad, as DMM is forced to review their prices and strategy, plus greed...

 

They have been warring with the community over stuff they themselves are guilty of, so please... No moral high ground for them or m$ or NDS or...

Edited by gorski, 22 September 2013 - 20:54.

[WanWizard]

You have a warped idea of what "support" means. So let me explain.

 

Support means that if there is something that doesn't work, you can come to us, and we can have a look at it, test it on the hardware we have, and if we find it, fix the problem.

This means that our support is limited to the hardware we have, we know, and we can develop and test on. We don't support anything else, regardless of the platform. full stop.

 

As to clones, I'm very happy for you that you are pleased with yours. It doesn't change the way we feel about them (those manufacturers have stolen and copied the design of another manufacturer, and then also stolen and in cases hacked their software), the experiences we have had with such cheap copies in the 10 years we've been making software for STB's, and it doesn't change the support situation.

 

So there is no point having this discussion.

[gorski]

Because there are points to be made that are valid and you just danced around all of the ones I raised...

 

What you said is correct for SOME clones but not for all! And that has to be said if one wants to be a fair man!

 

Now, if the statements of this sort are qualified, I can live with them, as I have such experiences. I am on the scene for a very long time and have a long memory, read a lot and therefore I know that there is a lot of material that supports your statement.

 

However, the "original" manufacturers have such products, too. And aplenty! Start with DMM! Their beginnings were abominable in many respects, HW and SW! So, this is perhaps more prevalent with some clones but not only can you see it in clones and not all clones are bad! Therefore, you should qualify your statements in this regard.

 

As for theft of SW and so on - please, remember m$, NDS, DMM and how they started... Full stop, as you say, to the "moral high-ground" from thieves, plagiators, hackers of competitors and whatnot...

[Lost in Space]

Theft ist theft.

 

And your arguments that somebody deserved it are often used by rapists too, so be carefull what you write.

 

PLi team has no choice, as supporting thefts or stolen property would be a legal abuse which can be also fined.

Edited by gutemine, 24 September 2013 - 12:19.

[MiLo]

As for clones, don't underestimate the cost involved in 'creating' a settop box.

Looking at typical hardware project's I've been in contact with, building a hardware design around a SOC, a few test runs and prototypes costs about 10k to 30k euros (or dollars). The effort going into drivers, low level support libraries and testsoftware will typically set you back about 150k or more. If there aren't many unforeseen problems.

That's why its so attractive to build a clone. You only have to spend a fraction of the cost, and since you can also copy the hardware design, all you need to do is spend a few weeks building a PCB an slapping components on it. And it's very low risk too - you only spend money on components.

People doing this, and people supporting them by buying their stuff, will put people like me out of work. That's why I don't like clones.

[pop_eye]

Ferrari and sim201 team and all people around them have really bad principles of living in a civilized society.

 

Let`s not tarnish the open source principle which is in my view the sum of all good things in the society: to learn, contribute and give back to your community.

 

If they fell obliged to contribute to community then why asking such high price for the clone equipment (even half price is too high) unless the sole purpose is to make a leaving out of it ?

 

What difference does it make at the end if DMM or others are charging an arm and a leg when you have the same attitude coming form the cloners party (but with price reduced ?)

 

I do not want to hear praising comments - that my box are better then yours - at the end it is all about money and no contribution whatsoever.

 

DMM made a software to be able to sell their hardware. Cloners are stealing all the needed software to be able to make a buck.

 

That is the reality.  Let`s not bring Openpli at the same level.

Edited by pop_eye, 24 September 2013 - 14:08.

[MiLo]

As for DMM, they have never really embraced open-source. Key to their success was "free porn". With "free" as in "free beer". All they ever wanted from the open source community was free code - "free" as in "free beer". Again.

Edited by MiLo, 24 September 2013 - 14:08.