14 replies to this topic

[athoik]

Decided to solve the Greek Debt Crisis via crowdfund. All I need is for everyone in EU to buy a Feta and Olive salad.

 

Unfortunately due to high traffic site is down!

 

[Erik Slagter]

LOL!!!

 

I'd rather fund smart guys like you, from which undoubtedly you have more than one in Greece

[malakudi]

This fund raising is stupid and insulting. First of all, Greek citizens don't owe anything to the IMF. The IMF program (and the EFSF program also) didn't give any money to Greek citizens. Those money were given to save the German and French banks in 2010-2011. Greece bankrupt in 2010, not now. Those programs only helped German and French banks to hide their exposure to Greek bonds. Those programs only helped those bankers to not register losses and keep getting their bonuses. The debt that bankers created, since they were the ones that kept buying bonds of a state that everyone knew it could not pay off those bonds. So, those programs converted banker losses to debt of Greece to the IMF, EFSF and through it, to several European countries.

 

Instead of cutting the value of those bonds to 50 or 60% (after all this was their value in exchange markets), and then maybe help those banks by giving them money, they chose to lend Greece money to pay those bonds, and in order to bring down the percentage of national debt vs GDP, they chose to cut up to 90% the bonds that the greek banks and greek insurance institutions were holding. And of course this led to even more problems - now IMF says you can't pay pentions because your insurance institutions don't have money! But it was their decision to cut the bonds to 90% - while paying the bonds of foreign banks.

 

I doubt these are known to our european friends. I guess what they know from their media is what Mr. Dijsselbloem or Mr. Schäuble say. That Greeks are lazy and corrupted and they want money for nothing. Money for nothing was given to bankers. There are people here that search the garbage to get something to eat. There is 30% unemployment, more than 50% in young people. There are people who commit suicide in their desperation.

 

Europe should either become the USE (United States of Europe) or drop the euro currency completely. In USA, if California bankrupts. the central goverment does not close the banks of California. This is what happens now in Greece. The ECB is denying liquidity in Greek banks, because we are no longer on a "program" and greek bonds don't have any value in exchange market.

 

We will vote "NO" to the referendum this Sunday. NO to the eternal austerity for our children and grandchildren and many more generations to come. NO to the concept of saving banks and bankers, and letting people die or live in poverty. We say NO to the ultimatum of  Mr. Dijsselbloem or Mr. Schäuble. We don't say NO to Europe, but we can't live like this any more. European leadership should decide if they want to help Greek people find their way inside the eurozone or if they want to humiliate us.

Edited by malakudi, 2 July 2015 - 15:42.

[athoik]

@malakudi,

 

I agree, they choose to save the banks.

 

Maybe this time, they will not repeat the same mistake, they will let Hellenic banks to bankrupt. Who cares about (our) savings? (Yes, we made our shit paximadi...).

 

And once again the people that took money out of Greece (oh yeah, there are so many, including politicians ofc), will be happy (because our little goat died..)!

 

And once again our friends will point the finger on us, we told ya!!!

 

I am really happy proud for my country, although it hurts me.

 

PS. Sorry for the slang

Edited by athoik, 2 July 2015 - 16:30.

[malakudi]

The banks are no longer "Hellenic". They are under the control of the ECB. The deposits in ECB banks are guaranteed up to 100.000 euro per person. If ECB wants to cut deposits less than 100.000 in greek banks, then the whole security that euro and eurozone offers will no longer be valid. In Cyprus they cut deposits above of 100.000. If they now cut under 100.000, then the euro currency as we know it will be history. And the people that gamble on international markets will choose their next victim (Spain, Italy, France)

[Frenske]

Guys, I can imagine that you like to express your opinion concerning all what is happening in Europe concerning Greece, but as this is just a technical orientated board we request not to express any political and / or religious opinions. I think there are more then enough possibilities to express your opinion on the Internet besides the OpenPLi support board.
So please let's keep it clear and technical.

I hope for your understanding and leave this topic open expecting you agree. More or less.

[malakudi]

@Frenske: I think that "The Lounge" can keep this thread. Personally, I wanted to express the situation here as I feel it, because I doubt that the media in your countries present the issue as it really is. As long as there are no insults or bad language, I think the discussion can take place. But if you think it can't, I'll not post anything else.

[Frenske]

Our main goal has always been, and still is, 'just technical related' topics.
We all know how discussions concerning politics and / or religious discussions sometimes end. So my request remains like before just discussing technical issues.

[gorski]

OKI, since this is my area of expertise, let me give what I can give, as you do in technical matters...

 

Here is some help in understanding the issues, from the best heads EU and the world have, Nobel prize laureates and onwards....

 

http://www.socialeurope.eu/#ios - an excellent resource for critically minded, most enlightened people on Earth, including free books, eBooks, articles and so on to download...

 

Like this one: http://socialeurope....3/12/SDRN-1.pdf

 

http://www.socialeur...rong-on-greece/ - the best Philosopher and Sociologist today, J. Habermas speaks out loud and clear!

 

http://www.socialeur...reek-democracy/ - the best Economist we have today, saying that the shape of EU and in particular Germany is the problem at  the moment, not Greece > http://www.socialeur...-greece-europe/

 

Enjoy roaming around the best site for yonks!!!

 

P.S. https://www.opendemocracy.net/ - one more of the kind, where for instance Greek professor of economics and current finance minister explains why to vote "NO" > https://www.opendemo...t-bullet-points

 

P.P.S. Galbraith, Stiglitz and Varoufakis together: http://real-economic...lbraith-on.html - best info from the "inside"...

[gorski]

I can't edit the above post any more, so here's a couple more..

 

http://www.telegraph...icide-pact.html

 

http://www.irishexam...one-335126.html

 

Edited by gorski, 3 July 2015 - 09:06.

[hemertje]

@ gorski

 

Our main goal has always been, and still is, 'just technical related' topics.
We all know how discussions concerning politics and / or religious discussions sometimes end. So my request remains like before just discussing technical issues.

 

!

[gorski]

?

 

I haven't discussed anything, just gave people the address to the best GIT Humanities know - what you do here in this hobby...

 

What's the harm in that?!?

[hemertje]

we do not want to provoke further reactions regarding politics and / or religious discussions...

Ss no links which can trigger further reactions.

[gorski]

First time ever: "it is bad to share"... and the best gathering we have on the planet... freely given away...

 

And no one is debating anything, as you can see but still...

 

I mean, honestly...

Edited by gorski, 3 July 2015 - 14:57.

[Jan Gruuthuse]

De landen binnen de eurozone hebben geprobeerd het IMF-rapport over de Griekse schulden te blokkeren. Dat meldden ingewijden in Brussel.

bron: de morgen

 

Exclusive: Europeans tried to block IMF debt report on Greece: sources

source: reuters