41 replies to this topic

[sjlouis]

Hi,

 

I've shared directories from a second disk (D:) on a PC with Windows 7 and I can access them from my Vu+ but with the same parameters on The Windows 10 PC, I can't access on a D: shared directories even if I can access on the C: shared directories.

 

I can access to the D: shared directories from the Windows 7 PC.

 

Thank you .

[WanWizard]

Probably related to the fact that SMBv1 is disabled on the latest Win10.  So you might have to include "vers=2.1" in the mount options.

 

It could also be that simple authentication methods are no longer accepted, so you might also want to try "auth=ntlmv2" in the mount options.

 

The VU+ runs an old kernel version, so it could well have outdated defaults.

[sjlouis]

Ok. It was only for a test because I have the same problem with a Zidoo box. And it seems it's also a SMBv1 problem. Otherwise I don't use it because it hangs the Pli box when the PC is off, it's not very convenient. I've bought the Zidoo box to get around the HDMI recording Vu+ problem. It's running Androïd and even if it's less evolved than Pli, it doesn't hang.

 

I've red the option command "_netdev" of mount command allows to wait the other device is connected before trying to mount it. Can't it be used to avoid box hangs?

 

Thank you WanWizard .

[WanWizard]

Whether or not something "hangs" depends on the way you mount it.

 

For devices which aren't always on, you can use autofs, which automatically mounts and disconnects depending on usage.

 

But in both cases, if you try to access a file via a mount on a server that isn't there anymore, you'll have to wait for a timeout.

[sjlouis]

I use the Pli screens to mount and access a network device. And when the device is not present, we get the spinner and I have to stop the box because the spinner works a very long time. I tried to wait an hour and I stopped the box. if here is a timeout, it's very very long .

[WanWizard]

The problem is that in the SMB protocol there is no provision for this, it is designed for Windows server, which should always be there. What happens is that Enigma requests data from the server, and because of it being gone, the driver retries indefinitely, and never returns control to Enigma.

 

As said, the only workaround is autofs with a short timeout, which basically does an automatic umount after inactivity or timeout. So it doesn't fix the problem, it just breaks the connection...

[sjlouis]

Yes but it would be better. Then do you think somebody could correct it in Pli to avoid to have to restart the box?

 

And I'm not sure I've understood : my Vu+ use an old protocol to connect to network and Windows 10 doesn't use it any more? The protocol depends of the firmware of the box and not from Enigma or Pli ?

Edited by sjlouis, 18 February 2018 - 11:07.

[WanWizard]

No, the problem (of the "hanging") is inherent to the CIFS linux kernel driver. Every linux installation has this problem. It's been a long standing issue that hasn't been addressed for years.

 

There are several versions of the SMB protocol, v1, v2.0, v2.1 and v3. (see https://blogs.techne...-are-you-using/ for more in-depth information).

 

Recently, due to severe security issues, SMBv1 has been disabled, not only in Windows 10, but also in the Synology NAS for example. Windows has the option to cycle through all available and allowed protocols, so you as a user don't notice anything, and don't know which protocol is used. But the Linux kernel driver doesn't. It connects using the version it has been programmed with, and if you as a user needs a different version, you need to specify this in the mount options.

 

Up to kernel v4.13, the default was SMBv1, after that, the default has been upgraded to SMBv3. So if you box has a kernel older than 4.13, and your "server" doesn't support SMBv1, you need to specify the version on the mount. Likewise, if your box runs 4.13 or higher, and your "server" doesn't support SMBv3, you also need to specify the version on the mount.

 

This is a good overview on this subject: https://www.happyass...ol-version-fun/

 

The same is true for the authentication mechanism. This used to be NTLM, but in Kernel 3.8 the default has changed to NTLMv2, as Windows no longer supports NTLM (also because of security issues). But depending on the version and configuration of Windows (especially Windows Server), you might need to specify an alternative mechanism on the commandline too.

Edited by WanWizard, 18 February 2018 - 14:07.

[sjlouis]

Waouaw! It's a little complex ! Ok, I begin to understand.

 

Just a little surprise, yesterday, I could access Windows 10 C: disk (and not D: disk) but I can't today. No matter. I've tried also with the Xtrend and it's the same result. It accesses Win 7 but not Win 10.

 

Thank you WanWizard .

[WanWizard]

I've added this information to the wiki: https://wiki.openpli...anager_Problems

[sjlouis]

Thanks, it's interesting but perhaps I haven't understood because I've replaced "rw" by "rw, sec=ntlm", restarted the box, re activate the link ant it does not always work .

[sjlouis]

I've red the wiki for SSD disks and now I can understand why when I copy file to a SSD disk, it's not so quick, but there is a surprise : it's much faster in ext4 format than in NTFS while it's similar for an USB key. I've done these tests today.

[WanWizard]

Ho, halt, stop.

 

There are TWO different issues with CIFS.

1. The default authentication mechanism changed from "ntlm" to "ntlmv2" in Linux kernel v3.8.
   You need to add "sec=ntlmv2" to your mount if your box kernel < 3.8 and your server doesn't support it. You need to add "sec=ntlm" to your mount options if you connect to a NAS that doesn't support ntlmv2. Windows always supports ntlmv2.
2. The default smb version changed from "SMBv1" to "SMBv3" in Linux kernel v4.13.
   You need to add "vers=2.1" (or a lower version) if you box kernel > 4.12 and your server doesn't support SMBv3 (a NAS, old Windows systems). You need to add "vers=3.0" (or a lower version) if your box kernel < 4.13 and your server doesn't support SMBv1 (up to date NAS systems, up to date Windows 8 and Windows 10, Windows Server).

[sjlouis]

I don't understand : the mechanism changes to "ntlmv2" with kernel v3.8 but I have to write "sec=ntlmv2" if my box kernel is < 3.8? Isn't it contradictory?

 

My Vu+ kernel is 3.14.28.

 

On a Zidoo forum, we are several users to have this problem and another user said to write "DISM /Online /Enable-Feature /All /FeatureName:SMB1Protocol" in a Windows command screen. Can it interfere with your solution?

[WanWizard]

Before 3.8 the default in the kernel driver was "ntlm", from 3.8 onwards, the default is "ntlmv2". So you only need to specify "sec=ntlmv2" if your kernel is older than 3.8, and you need ntlmv2 to connect.

 

Re-enabling SMBv1 on a server is a very bad idea, it has been disabled by the manufacturer for a reason, SMBv1 has a few big security holes. If the client supports SMBv2.0, SMBv2.1 or SMBv3, it is always better to use it. And all OpenPLi boxes do support it.

[sjlouis]

Before you answered, I have found how to activate and deactivate smb1 in Windows 10. I've deactivated it. I've tried also "rec, sec=ntlmv2" (it's the good one with my kernel, isn't it?) but it doesn't work no more.

 

Yesterday, I can't access to Win 10 but when I change the ip address from a Win 7 link to Win 10, it worked. I've tried again but no success. It's tough. And with the Zidoo, some boys access to Win 10 and others not whine the parameters seem to be the same.

 

If you don't know, no matter, it's not really important . It was for challenge.

[WanWizard]

I think we're talking on different plains here.

 

You DONT NEED the "sec" parameter, your kernel is newer than 3.8, and Windows wants ntlmv2, so the default is fine. the "sec" parameter has NOTHING to do with the SMB version!

 

If your server doesn't support SMBv1, you need to add "vers=3.0" (or "vers=2.1").

 

p.s. "rec" is an invalid option, so I can imagine the mount fails with that option.

Edited by WanWizard, 18 February 2018 - 17:37.

[sjlouis]

Sorry, it was a writing error, I have "rw". It does not work with "rw, vers=3.0" and "rw, vers=2.1".

 

It's frustrating but no matter   .

 

I hope you a good evening WanWizard .

[WanWizard]

I'll find a Windows !0 system somewhere, and I'm going to test it.

[sjlouis]

Waouaw! Thank you WanWizzard but don't spend too much time   .