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Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules


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#1 COLDK

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Posted 24 June 2018 - 11:44

Hi Forum.

 

I have been the happy owner of a Vu+Duo for some time. I bought this model in order to be able to record one program while watching another. When shifting to the Vu+ I also fitted dual LNB on my dishes and installed an extra cable so I have a LNB available for each tuner

 

Till now I have been trying to record and wathc but I haven´t had much luck. I have been doing some reading and found uot that aparently one CI module is only able to provide decoding af one channel at a time.

 

My last go at the problem then was to purchase an extra CI module and viewing card from my provider but with two CI modules I still have the problem. The only difference is that I don´t see as many channels in my favourites list which are "greyed out"

 

After that defeat I did some more reading here in the forums where some members are asking similar but not totally alike problems and it seems that even if the receiver has two seperate CI modules it will only be able to decode one channel. Like other members I have tested each CI module seperately in both CI slots on the receiver and they work fine in all combinations

 

My questions

1. Am I correct in the above assumtion that the receiver is able to decode only one channel even though two CI modules are available - or am I doing something wrong?

2. is it a hardware or a software issue?

3. Will a newer model Vu+Duo be able to make use of both CI modules? If not - are there other brands on the market that will solve this problem?

 

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

Best regards

 

Carsten



Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #2 WanWizard

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Posted 24 June 2018 - 11:52

A CI module can decode only channels from one transponder. So it is not technically limited to one channel (although the provider my limit it), but to all changes from that same transponder. If your box can work with two CI modules, you can use the CI assignment plugin, to manually loadbalance your channels over the two modules, so all channels of transponder A to the first module, and all channels of transponder B to the second module. A few forum members have reported this might work.

 

If your channels become greyed out when you start a recording, the box has detected you have no tuner available to receive them. The box doesn't know what you can or can't decode.


Many answers to your question can be found in our new and improved wiki.

Currently in active use: VU+Solo 4K (1xFBC, 2xS2), VU+Zero, Edision OS mini+, Amiko Viper 2TC, Zgemma H3.2TC, Zgemma H6

For testing purposes: XP1000, Formuler F1 (2xS2), Miraclebox Premium Micro (S2+C/T), ET7500 (S2), ET8500 (S2), Zgemma H2.H (S2+C), Zgemma H5.2TC, SAB TripleAlpha (S2+C/T), Galaxy 4K (FBC), VU Zero 4K, HD2400 (4xS2), ET10000 (4xS2), VU+Duo2 (1xS2), Edision OS nino


Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #3 COLDK

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Posted 24 June 2018 - 12:10

Hi WanWizzard.

 

Thanks for the quick reply and also for letting me know about the workaround. My problem though is that I often wish to record and watch a program from same transponder :-).....I will give it a try - do I find the pluin via the box?

 

It looks like I have all channels available when i try to select a second channel so I believe that a tuner is available but it fails to get access to a second CI module

 

Still though - because I am considering bying a new receiver -  I am interested in knowing if the Vu+Dou or other receivers on the market are able to work with 2 CI modules without making a workaround.....or is that a question in another forum?

 

 

Best regards

 

carsten



Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #4 Erik Slagter

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Posted 24 June 2018 - 15:06

Not all modules can decode more than one service though.


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Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #5 gutemine

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Posted 24 June 2018 - 15:24

Latest Dreamboxes with DreamOS enigma2 and my Service Relation Plugin can use 2 CIs nicely to show PIP or show and record 2 Channels on the same transponder, even when the 2 Modules are NOT offering any Multicrypt.

 

Technically this is pretty simple to implement :D  but as my Service Relation Plugin has inherited the "Dreambox only" License from Dr. Best's PIP Service Relation plugin  (where is originates frrom) you are on your own with a solution for this issue.


Edited by gutemine, 24 June 2018 - 15:24.


Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #6 COLDK

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Posted 24 June 2018 - 16:37

Hi Forum.

 

Thanks for your time and answers.

 

@ Erik Slagter, are you able to be more specific....Am I right when I think of a service as a single TV channel? I am trying to get my head around why I am no able to watch and record at the same time allthough I have all the single parts available and they all work individually (Dual LNB, 2 tuners, 2 CI+ modules, 2 CI+ slots in the receiver)

 

It might end up with me buying another box, but I am curious of why I can´t make it work  :)

 

 

@ gutemine, thanks for the info - I will have that in mind if I end up buying a new box. However I must say that I have been really pleased with the Vu+ ....except for the problem above  :D

 

 

Best regards

 

Carsten



Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #7 WanWizard

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Posted 24 June 2018 - 16:39

You can only watch or record encrypted channels if they are on the same transponder.

 

If you have two CI modules from the same provider, you have to use the CI assignment plugin to manually loadbalance channels over the two.

 

You keep responding "it doesn't work" without saying if you have taken these restrictions into account.


Many answers to your question can be found in our new and improved wiki.

Currently in active use: VU+Solo 4K (1xFBC, 2xS2), VU+Zero, Edision OS mini+, Amiko Viper 2TC, Zgemma H3.2TC, Zgemma H6

For testing purposes: XP1000, Formuler F1 (2xS2), Miraclebox Premium Micro (S2+C/T), ET7500 (S2), ET8500 (S2), Zgemma H2.H (S2+C), Zgemma H5.2TC, SAB TripleAlpha (S2+C/T), Galaxy 4K (FBC), VU Zero 4K, HD2400 (4xS2), ET10000 (4xS2), VU+Duo2 (1xS2), Edision OS nino


Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #8 COLDK

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Posted 24 June 2018 - 17:11

Hi Wanwizzard

 

My bad...I downloaded the CI assignment plugin but was not able to find it among the other plugins.

 

Now - after your reply - I have looked deeper and located it at the settings for CI module ...and the initial test - just with a few channels - seems to work. Will test further and post result.

 

 

best regards

 

Carsten



Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #9 COLDK

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 06:45

Hi Forum.

 

A short update.

 

I have tested the possibilities using the CI module plugin.Since I am only receiving feed from a single provider I was left with the option to assign services to each CI+ module. It solves the issue by 50% meaning that if I assign all uneven services to module 1 and all even to module 2 I will be able to watch an even channel while recording an uneven but still I am not able to watch an uneven while recording an an uneven. When I shift to a service using the same CI+ module i get a black screen. Also if I try watching a service from same transponder as I record from I get a black screen.

 

I am aware that there are many ways to devide services into the 2 modules but basically I will not be able to record and random choose another service among my providers services which is my intent.

 

Actually I am a little bit surprised that the box doesn´t have an option to be able to record and watch a service from same provider as a standard feature - and it brings me back to one of my initial questions: Is it a hardware or a software issue.....since I have been putting a lot of energy into trying to solve the above issue I am still corious of why.?

 

I am getting more convinced that I probably need to buy another box but as I stated earlier I am actually pleased with my box so other workarounds which might help are more than welcome  :)

 

 

Best regards

 

Carsten



Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #10 gutemine

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 07:37

Randomly assign channels....what a nonsense and waste of Hardware ....

Under DreamOS enigma2 you simply assign all encryptable channels to both modules and the system decides which module to use and only if one is already busy uses the second one.

This is as it should be ... not what you are proposing. And as I already posted this even works on same Transponder with the help of my plugin, despite that such modules normally don't support Multicrypt.

Finally yes, this is poor software...

Edited by gutemine, 25 June 2018 - 07:40.


Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #11 COLDK

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 08:38

Hi Forum.

 

Another update

 

I think I have to appologize for not stating in the header that I am asking about CI+ technology which is what my provider uses. I have become aware when reading  posts on different sites it seems like CI technology offers possibilities to use hardware or software which will let the box use the CI on more services. However when it comes to CI+ I often read that this is not supported.

 

@gutemine: Does your earlier replies also apply to CI+ modules?

 

Sorry for confusing the matter....

 

 

Best regards

 

Carsten



Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #12 gutemine

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 09:48

Yes it applies as most CI+ modules are supporting only single channel encryption. VU supports offline decryption to overcome this limitation for recordings, but PLi doesn't support this, and this doesn't help for pip or freely changing channels while recordings are running.

Especially in cable where it is relatively easy and cheap to get another module....for a second tv... this is a pain and not a good solution either.

Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #13 WanWizard

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 10:11

@ColdK,

 

Don't pay much attention to gutemine, he's a troll on the payroll of Dream Multimedia. Dream is the best since sliced bread, and the rest is crap.

 

When you load balance your CI modules (yes, OpenPLi doesn't do that automatic yet), do this per transponder, not per channel. So assign ALL channels of the same transponder to the same CI module.

 

And OpenPLi supports offline decryption on ALL boxes that support this in hardware and drivers.


Many answers to your question can be found in our new and improved wiki.

Currently in active use: VU+Solo 4K (1xFBC, 2xS2), VU+Zero, Edision OS mini+, Amiko Viper 2TC, Zgemma H3.2TC, Zgemma H6

For testing purposes: XP1000, Formuler F1 (2xS2), Miraclebox Premium Micro (S2+C/T), ET7500 (S2), ET8500 (S2), Zgemma H2.H (S2+C), Zgemma H5.2TC, SAB TripleAlpha (S2+C/T), Galaxy 4K (FBC), VU Zero 4K, HD2400 (4xS2), ET10000 (4xS2), VU+Duo2 (1xS2), Edision OS nino


Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #14 gutemine

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 11:21

My opinion ist not paid by anybody, and it is not my fault that you never managed to implement this working properly.

Thanks for the update on offline encryption

Edited by gutemine, 25 June 2018 - 11:23.


Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #15 WanWizard

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 11:55

My opinion ist not paid by anybody, and it is not my fault that you never managed to implement this working properly.

 

You could have fooled me. And most others, the way you drool over everything related to Dream.

 

And the rest of your remark is bollocks. It isn't implemented because nobody ever felt the need to work on it, and that is because nobody ever asked about it, until recently. The number of OpenPLi users that use a CI module are few and far between...

 

And I told you before, if you are so brillant, contribute. And if you don't want to, STFU, you're just a troll.


Many answers to your question can be found in our new and improved wiki.

Currently in active use: VU+Solo 4K (1xFBC, 2xS2), VU+Zero, Edision OS mini+, Amiko Viper 2TC, Zgemma H3.2TC, Zgemma H6

For testing purposes: XP1000, Formuler F1 (2xS2), Miraclebox Premium Micro (S2+C/T), ET7500 (S2), ET8500 (S2), Zgemma H2.H (S2+C), Zgemma H5.2TC, SAB TripleAlpha (S2+C/T), Galaxy 4K (FBC), VU Zero 4K, HD2400 (4xS2), ET10000 (4xS2), VU+Duo2 (1xS2), Edision OS nino


Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #16 gutemine

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 12:33

Look, I just answered the 3 questions of the OP, just because you don't like the answers I'm not a troll and they are not wrong either.

Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #17 mimisiku

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 12:53

Let’s keep it Nice. Laten we het gezellig houden. Gutemine doet het DreamOS gebeuren en jullie OpenPli. Gewoon gescheiden houden of van elkaar leren. CI+ zal noodgedwongen ook door OpenPli opgepakt moeten worden. Of ze willen of niet. M7 is de laatste met losse kaarten en dat is straks met ORCA echt over! Heb dit ruim een jaar geleden al eens aangekaart. Als de Seca kaart straks tot het verleden behoort én OpenPli doet niets dan verlaat men gewoon OpenPli voor wat anders wat wél werkt. Zo simpel is het.
VU+ Solo SE v2 Optus NZ

Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #18 gutemine

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 15:23

It is not that simple because as you said CI+ modeles become more and more popular and now even cardless ones where there is no other choice.

The trick how to use 2 modules on same transponder would work also with OpenPLi but it needs changes that currently nobody seems to be willing to do, so for the moment the OP will have to live with this situation. Which was his original question.

If you want to know the trick you would just need to ask ... Friendly...

Edited by gutemine, 25 June 2018 - 15:26.


Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #19 littlesat

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 17:39

We are not allowed to support the plus from ci+... because we can get ‘noticed’ by the ‘ci+ police’.. Maybe dreamOs is not afraid of the ci+ police?

Edited by littlesat, 25 June 2018 - 17:41.

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Re: Vu+Duo Recording problems using dual CI modules #20 WanWizard

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Posted 25 June 2018 - 17:57

This is not about CI+, this is about loadbalancing/selectting a CI module when you have multiple CI modules from the same provider.


Many answers to your question can be found in our new and improved wiki.

Currently in active use: VU+Solo 4K (1xFBC, 2xS2), VU+Zero, Edision OS mini+, Amiko Viper 2TC, Zgemma H3.2TC, Zgemma H6

For testing purposes: XP1000, Formuler F1 (2xS2), Miraclebox Premium Micro (S2+C/T), ET7500 (S2), ET8500 (S2), Zgemma H2.H (S2+C), Zgemma H5.2TC, SAB TripleAlpha (S2+C/T), Galaxy 4K (FBC), VU Zero 4K, HD2400 (4xS2), ET10000 (4xS2), VU+Duo2 (1xS2), Edision OS nino





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