48 replies to this topic

[WanWizard]

Am I still clueless to what your issue is.

 

Al I got from this thread was "I can't move up or down in an empty EPG screen" to which you gave gotten the solution from both me and Pr2.

 

What other problems are there?

[ArloG]

Am I still clueless to what your issue is.

 

Al I got from this thread was "I can't move up or down in an empty EPG screen" to which you gave gotten the solution from both me and Pr2.

 

What other problems are there?

Sir. With the most respect. Look at my videos.
I've just started my scans using OpenATV 6.2. Nothing could be easier.
Look at my videos once again. Your suggested solutions do not work or partially work.
Get a Zgemma H7.AC or one of its variants.
The remote control is intuitive and works fluidly with the receiver.
I understand that engineers who work with devices on a daily basis sometimes forget that their ideas or what they have become accustomed to doing is not easy for the masses.

In my career I have had to parse technical manuals so that people operating machinery could grasp the operation.
I have also had the pleasure of working with software engineers who understand "their way" which makes no sense to the end user or is very difficult to grasp.
Some have never had field experience in the operation of their own equipment. Once given a chance to speak one on one with them and explain the difficulty, they usually "got it".

In this OS for my receiver if re-learning how the remote interface acts upon the receiver requires forgetting everything of how 99.9% of remote controls work for every other device out there,
this operating system is basically useless. A simple remapping of the commands and comparing how this and every other receiver/tuner/television out there works is very much needed.

I'm looking at my brand new Sony 4K remote control.
EPG works like it should with the press of a button.
Arrow keys switch programs. Select different time slots. The center OK button goes to (or Zaps) the chosen channel.
I don't have to hunt for a red button, if a time slot is empty for a program....the channel still lands there. If there isn't a channel viewable there....it's my problem.

Now I pick up the 2 other FTA satellite receiver remote controls I have in separate rooms.
Different receivers with different remote controls but similarly marked buttons.
When a relative comes to stay the weekend. There is no college course on how to watch tv in the spare room.

OpenPLI on the Zgemma would make even the mother in law go home in a hurry. Hmmmm. Good idea, huh?

As mentioned. Go to a television store. Choose your TV. Pick up a remote. Use it.
Go to the next brand of TV. Do the same thing. From the cheapest to the most expensive.
They just work.

G'day!

 

[ims]

And You also forgot Philips RC's as ethalon for it too  

Your problem is empty EPG...

 

Why do you need toggle between service and epg column (with Ch+/-)? Up/Down moving whole list. But when you have empty epg, it cannot work.

OK will ZAP if you set it there in setup GMEPG ... because it is plugin, use it's setting (Menu, Menu).

And do not write about stupid TV's controllers - it is ridiculous ...

[WanWizard]

I have looked at the video. I see you opening the EPG screen with no EPG in it, I see you press the down arrow franticly and nothing happens.

 

I explained to you twice WHY that is the case, and HOW to change that behaviour. I don't know why you are so stubborn?

[ArloG]

I have looked at the video. I see you opening the EPG screen with no EPG in it, I see you press the down arrow franticly and nothing happens.

 

I explained to you twice WHY that is the case, and HOW to change that behaviour. I don't know why you are so stubborn?

I'll have to wait and see if dev's get a clue.
It should not be so difficult. Yes, I did change those settings and yes it did partially work.
It did not address the fact that later on after a few scans I used DreamsetEditor to place my Last Scanned sats in folders named for the positions and sat name.
The <Prev  Next> button did not cycle through the "boquets" I created. And several other functions that were self explanatory when I first setup and turned on the receiver did not work.

You do need to understand that I DID search this and other forums for the reasons why my keys were not working. Perhaps a solid hour.

To your staff. I am not being a hard-head about this. Simply stating facts.
I invite you to go to the Zgemma site and read the owners manual for the H7 series (and other models) of receiver.
And pick up and operate the receivers with factory firmware. It does not take 30 minutes to become fluid in the operation if one is familiar with these boxes.
Developers need to take things like this into consideration so that the end user will not suffer so much confusion when going from one OS to another.

From your statement about different computer operating systems.
Power buttons, mouse control, and for Linux and Windows, file and folder navigation in the GUI is basically the same.
At first when people were touting the plusses of Linux, Windows users were frustrated that at lease Mac pc's were much easier to use.
And folks like Dell (and others) who offered Linux as an alternative OS on the computers they sold for the masses soon dropped the option.
Why? The overwhelming amount of service calls to help desks not manned by English speaking customers.
But that's another ball of wax.

2 different versions of OpenPLI and several hours of plugging around trying to figure which buttons would let me easily navigate what was so simple to do out-of-box with the factory installed firmware.

I can see that you stand firm in your belief that it is me and is my issues not understanding the use of OpenPLI.
A few lines of code, a few default setting changes (not needed to be discovered immediately by end users) and I may have said Wonderful Job.

I believe that for now I am finished writing the facts and stating the bugs of this firmware. Perhaps seasoned users are used to klunking around getting used to navigating the key mapping and menus not so apparent. And perhaps they will read and relate to my experience in the few hours I used two different versions of OpenPLI. Or it may be that the coders are just not familiar with the Zgemma receivers enough and write code that satisfies getting it out for those receivers. Nevertheless, a users manual would be in order if changing the wheel so to speak is OpenPLI's idea of STB firmware.

Regards
 

[WanWizard]

You don't seem to get the message.

 

You assume that everything you can find that you can install on your H7 works identical. And I've been trying to explain to you your assumptions are wrong. You can not use an H7 manual to operate an OpenPLi image, you can't use a Windows manual to operate a Mac, and you can't use a Mercedes manual to operate a Toyota. It is as simple as that.

 

You come across as a person that buys a Dell, removes its default Windows installation and installs Linux on it, and then expects it to work exactly as before.

 

I've been a member of the team for 12 years, and you are the first one (I come across) that stubbornly tries to zap using an EPG without EPG, and refuses the use the channel list that the rest of the world uses. Even though we accept you are a new user who still needs to learn how everything works. And it has been pointed out to you you've been using it wrong, but if you want to use it your way, you need to change the default configuration a bit to accomodate you.

 

I think it is pointless to change default configuration simply to accomodate you, and with that change annoy everyone else.

 

So yes, it is you.

[jenseneverest]

The h7 "factory image"  is just a very old version of openATV, if you prefer openATV it is probably a good idea to flash it with that. 

There is nothing wrong with the keymap on my h7 using openpli.

[ArloG]

Ok. I've resigned myself as completely confused.
Could an advanced member direct me and post screen shots of the settings to:

Make the <PREV NEXT> button switch "Bouquets> in the epg.

Make the remote control work as much as the same it does in my first video using openatv with openpli.

Offer advice to help understand the amount of frustration it appears I've had.

Post links of how to populate the epg with data for satellites in the range of 58 W to 127 W.

I'm willing to give it another try if navigating channels could be made much easier.

Some day I may be able to help others.

Thank you all.

 

[ims]

 

Make the <PREV NEXT> button switch "Bouquets> in the epg.

Tell me why ???

[WanWizard]

I looked at the ATV video again.

 

For the EPG arrows, I'll try to explain it for the third time: When in the EPG, press the menu button twice to get into the Setup menu. Seventh option is "Skip empty services", set this to "No" and press "green" to save.

 

As I don't have an H7 or H7 remote, what buttons are "PREV" and "NEXT"? I've looked up an picture of it, and I see 4 arrow keys, a volume up/down, and a channel/page up/down. So which ones do you mean, and what should they do where? If I press the channel/page up/down in the EPG, it cycles through my channel bouquets just as in the video?

[Pr2]

Hi,

 

You need to learn which key to press to have the action you want and not turn it the opposite way, I decide which keys I want to press so please developper change it because I don't want to start learning new why of moving between channels.

 

Did you check really your RCU?  Have you see that there is a button called HELP? Have you already press this button while you are in the EPG? I guess no because everything is explained there.

 

The behavior that you want is on the P+/P- (also called CH+/CH-) on some remote control, so once you know it use it.

 

As WanWizard already explain to you many times when you change car brand you need to adapt yourself to some switches position, for exemple to turn on the frog lamp, once your car is purchased do you go to the car sellers and say in my former car the switches was there please move it to have it at the same position because I think that it should be there?

 

Did you already try the normal method to browse and the channel list (pressing the Up or Down arrow around the OK button)? And start zapping from it?

Moreover if you go into the different configuration menus you can tune lot of things to match your expectation.

 

For exemple I configure that when I press the up arrow to go into the channel list it keeps the current service (a service is a channel list) because that's the bahavior that I want to have.

 

And last point, since you switch to a Linux receiver you have the choice of the image and the skin that you can use, if you are happy with the original Zgemma firmware, or you prefer OpenATV please use them, why do you want to use OpenPLi?

You have the choice that's why some people prefer an image rather than another one.

 

Pr2

[ims]

Next/Prev is same on all RCs - row with:  "<"  "0"  ">"  (H7 has there text too <PREV 0 NEXT> )

[WanWizard]

Ah.

 

Then I'm fully with your "Why would you want to do that"? 

[Pr2]

Since P+/P- (or CH+/CH-) is doing it.

[ArloG]

Just when I've almost given up.
The help button? Well now there's one!
So you say a skin may change what I'm looking for?
Zap is such a Dreambox term. Zap to the masses besides satellite STB's is understood as "wipe all settings and return to default state".
Something in the industrial you would want to lock an operator from doing. "You WHAT? You Zapped it??"

Cars keep coming up here. Cool. One of my passions. Big American cars with lots of horsepower, huge engines, a four-on-the-floor, and power to rip the seat bolts out when you go from 1st to 2nd and put your girlfriend in the back seat. Or back in the day, your buddy would duck in the back seat when Van Halen was jamming in the Pioneer cassette deck and the tape would launch out into the rear package shelf when you floored it.
Yeah, been there. Sort of still am. Now it's an Evo X with an engine built ground up making something like 560hp....whatever that is in the stupid kilowatts people use now.

3 things certain:
The gas pedal, clutch, and brake are always in the same spot. Right or left hand drive. And so I believe the turn signal is too.
Any vehicle with Lucas Electrics will leave you stranded.
And heaven forbid your buddy lets you take the 911 Carrera out for a spin on a fall day and the sun goes down and you want to turn on the heater.
Did someone say "Steampunk? Sheesh. Pulling levers and pushing handles and twisting dials. Just to get a little heat? Auf and Zu and deschwartensplattendespieler silk screened all over the place!
It was fun seeing tourists rent a car and take off into oncoming traffic on the "wrong side of the road"....for us it's the right side of the road....on the right side!
I could almost imagine hearing 'Throckmorton, you Bluddy Twit'...or"ning-pow-ping" coming from the wife.

American Muscle cars with big engines made before 1970 with bores big enough to put an entire vintage oil can in and still can get your fingers in to pick it out.
That can burn rubber off faster than Akron can make tires. MOPARS!
LOL. "skins....help buttons".



 

[el bandido]

Almost all American satellite FTA channels do not have EPG. Looks like you have a selection of free and scrambled channels for 127 West? Would probably be easier to just have the free channels.
American EPG does work on the OTA ATSC channels - or at least the OTA channels that have EPG.

I can understand your frustrations with the remote settings, but the remote can be mapped to a degree by using the User interface menu, and then even further by using the Hotkey menu. Attached is a screencap of my User interface settings. This menu is located at: Menu--->Setup--->System--->GUI settings--->User interface. Enable neutrino style zap control, plus the other two settings below it as shown in the attached screencap. See if doing that makes life a bit easier.

 

Attached Files

•  User_Interface_PLi.jpg   128.7KB   2 downloads

[el bandido]

You may also find the OpenPLi Wiki helpful.
https://wiki.openpli.org/Main_Page
https://wiki.openpli...Tips_and_Tweaks

[ArloG]

Thanks El
I saw a statement resembling "nobody zaps from the epg".
Yes they do...and with without a doubt the defacto standard.
Question to the person. Do YOU nav to the guide, see Sanford and Son reruns. Then exit the guide and scrolll to your channel list, and zap it?
If you do I have some property in the Pacific I'd love to sell you.
Kodi, Emby, Every television, cable box. Scroll the epg until you find your program and smack ENTER (or OK).
Terrestrial, cable, satellite? Previous/Next.
Crap. It's cold in here. Winter is coming. I better go sit in the the 911,  and throw a handful of levers and knobs.
Because reaching over to the the wall and pressing the up button on the thermostat is just too hard.
Another statement saying "stupid tv controllers". The person must have a vacuum tube tv with a detent tuner where the beer stays at his arm chair and he trots to the...Lowe Opta. Or Zenith.
I did not come here to argue. Nor to complain. It may look like it.
I'll finish up openatv and mapping my sats and channels. The ASC1 is awesome. Then perform a backup to the 1 gig drive I put in the H7. And restore the openpli build from that drive.
Not bad for a week into this.

Let's ask this question. All of these softwares are Linux. All have the basic same directory structure. Before getting the Zgemma, I read. And alot.
I also am interested in the "decoders" available. OpenPli has them built in. OpenATV does not.
"Stupid RC's". What is so stupid that I plugged it in. Breezed through the users manual for 5 minutes. And when I had my first few sats scanned in. I was navigating the menus and epg screen like a boss?
Channel up is channel up.
Channel down is channel down.
Previous and next is just that.
I didn't NEED the help key.

Because the Linux coders who put a little marmalade on and called it "whatever STB firmware" thought about the end user.
So easy a 3 year old could use it.
So what is the personna of a person changing the wheel?
My suspect mind tells me the dev's did not have one of these receivers but knew it had an ARM 7 processor and resembled other ones like it.
So it must be the same. And tossed some code in a box and called it a day.
Hence revisions and nightly releases.

The help key will be the first place I go when I get pli restored.

I have to be done with this. Add refresh myself using telnet. I guess.
"Hey dude, look at this". "Try it out"......."ummmm how-do-you-change-channels?"
Stanford, my friend. Or Cambridge.

[ArloG]

Okay Einsteins.
How would you clear out the previous scans in Menu>Setup>Service searching>Automatic scan?
Common with the Enigma2 versions.
Huh?

[el bandido]

There are no previous scans to clear out in: Menu>Setup>Service searching>Automatic scan. Maybe explain a bit better what you are trying to do or what you are trying to clear or delete.