43 replies to this topic

[ambrosa]

As discuss here http://openpli.org/f...lem-with-plihd/, since some versions ago in PliHD skin (very nice !) is missing the SNR,AGC,BER infos and its coloured bars.

About 2-3 weeks ago all was fine. A friend of mine has an old Openpli (installed about 3 weeks ago) and infos are there.

Now infos are missing (for any type of signal, either DVBT, DVBS/S2). Feature or bug ?

[ims]

feature...

[Alias1]

feature...

ROFL

[littlesat]

I did remove them because they were big and ugly.... When someone (I do not want it to be only my creation) can put them back but smaller and less ugly (do not use the rainbows, just something discrete) I can consider to put them back... I recommend to put only the SNR in a BAR there as AGC and BER does not deliver any information at all...

In the skin.xml they are currently just commented out by <!--...-->.

Edited by littlesat, 2 December 2011 - 10:21.

[Dimitrij]

I did remove them because they were big and ugly....

[Erik Slagter]

I think the OP has missed the concept of the second info bar.

[ims]

... ok ... and name of Service over PIG in last changes is discrete ?

[littlesat]

That was also a request from the PLi-team .... but we're talking about taste... I can move the channel name on top of the PIG were it was during the servicelist...

IMS, which editor are you using to edit the skin.xml? because when I merge something from you I get ^M charactors... Please use komodo edit or so,

Edited by littlesat, 2 December 2011 - 11:15.

[ambrosa]

Littlesat, I cannot agree with you that coloured bars are ugly. But they are not important so you can remove them (as you did).

I think that SNR, AGC and BER infos are mandatory !
PLEASE re-add again SNR, AGC and BER in text numeric format in second infobar.
Something like:
SNR: 86%
AGC: 100%
BER: 126

This is enough to have infos about signal quality.

[littlesat]

BER and AGC are not mandatory - in fact there is no added info in them. The BER is always 0... except when you do not have a clear picture and the AGC does not inducate anything about the signal......

The only proper info for the satellite signal is currently the SNR....

I will consider to add only this one again as progression bar.... but only if someone delivered me a more discrete progression bar -as- the rainbow stuff is too big and ugly....

The numbers for BER and AGC are ok...

Please come with some suggestions... it should be not only my skin.

I want to make the skin easy and it should bring rest to your eyes...

[ims]

That was also a request from the PLi-team .... but we're talking about taste... I can move the channel name on top of the PIG were it was during the servicelist...

IMS, which editor are you using to edit the skin.xml? because when I merge something from you I get ^M charactors... Please use komodo edit or so,

for me was easy using gedit, then copy+paste to Fork.
Dont know, where I get ^M on end of lines... It was always or several commit only ?

I think, must be set some rules too ... some parts begin on y=100, 110 ..., some on x=590, 600, 560, 530 etc ...
F.eg. Location (yellow in Movies) ... it begin on 520,100 imho.

[Erik Slagter]

I agree you only need a large SNR bar when configuring the dish, and for that you'd use the satfinder. A "discreet" (which has another meaning than "discrete") mentioning on the infobar is okay by me, afaik it's like that at the moment.

[Alias1]

BER and AGC are not mandatory - in fact there is no added info in them. The BER is always 0... except when you do not have a clear picture and the AGC does not inducate anything about the signal......

The only proper info for the satellite signal is currently the SNR....

I will consider to add only this one again as progression bar.... but only if someone delivered me a more discrete progression bar -as- the rainbow stuff is too big and ugly....

The numbers for BER and AGC are ok...

Please come with some suggestions... it should be not only my skin.

I want to make the skin easy and it should bring rest to your eyes...

Hey man I did give you a solution but you didnt like it

[Erik Slagter]

Being?

The problem is that most of this information is not relevant for normal television watching, so it shouldn't be in the infobar. I think there is no discussion about that.

[ims]

BER = 0 means: a) does not work on good configured dish is always 0 ?

( Always, when I configuring my dish, I connect DM7020, set dish to max. SNR and then checking BER for outer LNB's and making fine configuring for BER near 0. )

[ambrosa]

BER and AGC are not mandatory - in fact there is no added info in them. The BER is always 0... except when you do not have a clear picture and the AGC does not inducate anything about the signal......

This is completely WRONG.
Yes, BER and AGC are usually not important for DVBS/S2 and BER usually is = 0
But sometimes with bad weather condition (heavy rain, fog, snow) I can see BER >0 , low SNR and low AGC: this can explain to user what's happen to its dish, i.e. dish has lost focus to satellite.
It's not true "in fact there is no added info in them" : there are infos !

And they are very and more important in DVB-T stream where trasmission problem are more complex.
I can have an high SNR, a good AGC but have an high BER and obviously have problem watching video: these infos are important to detect some problem with terrestrial antenna, bad weather condition or a bird attached to antenna

In my opinion the second infobar is the place where to put additional infos, not always needed, like: crypto infos, full epg data and .. full signal quality parameters.
I agree that coloured bars are ugly. But, please, I repeat to you (like a parrot): put SNR,AGC,BER numerical values. They ARE important.

[littlesat]

I think the low SNR is already enough then.... That the picture is blocked is the indication of an higher BER... AGC can even be high at bad weather conditions i.s.o. low....

But when you can post a complete consideration here I'm still able to consider merging it.

Edited by littlesat, 2 December 2011 - 14:15.

[ambrosa]

I'm not a TV signal expert but I can only report to you my experience.

I'm agree with you that with DVB-S/S2 SNR can be enough as the only signal quality parameter. Now it's in "first infobar" at the lower right corner.

But with DVB-T signal, things are bit different.
People has watching a DVBT video stream. But "it freeze. Why ? SNR is 99% !"
Often, as I said before, there is an high BER value with an excellent SNR.
If I have not BER I cannot detect if problem is made from antenna or local (i.e. STB CPU overloaded by some local process) because I see only SNR and SNR value is very good.

A cannot say to you anymore.

If in your opinion AGC and BER are not useful, don't worry. I change my skin with another that have these parameters.

[DrAk3]

Please reintroduce the BER meter into the second infobar. I agree with ambrosa, sometimes is very usefull and i'm always using it...

D.

[littlesat]

The BER as bar I never reintroduce as this has in fact no additional information... As number OK...

But please make some consideration that looks good.... as currently I have no idea how to do that - so now I simply removed the complete rainbow stuff in discussion with the PLi-team/

As it was will never come back.

Why do I have to invent everything here? You can also modify the skin and forward your suggestions here instead of yelling. A quick look at the skin.xml will learn that in fact everyone can make pathes there.

If in your opinion AGC and BER are not useful, don't worry. I change my skin with another that have these parameters.

Then enjoy the non-usable stuff... please think about the extra info the AGC and BER gives you.... it is really almost no additional information about the satellite signal... Is is simply just it was there and you was used to it... Please think about this concretely.

The BER does only contain added value if it can be moved to the inner FEC... there we are able to create really good vallues for it. As I did a long time ago for E1... But for E2 (DVB-S2 tuners) it seems not to be possible to place the BER to the inner FEC.

Edited by littlesat, 2 December 2011 - 14:54.