106 replies to this topic

[Erik Slagter]

It's something I wanted to test but never did. So you so say you did and doesn't work on the older FBC tuners?

[Rob van der Does]

I do.

[nor50]

Can someone explain what multistream is? Is it that it's possible to record all channels on one transponder?

[WanWizard]

No, it is simply said a multiplexing mechanism to put multiple channels in a single datastream. I can only assume it has to do with transponder bandwidth saving.

[Huevos]

 

 

 

The new drivers bring support for Multistream to the 45308X DVB-S2X tuners.

 
Which boxes use these 45308X tuners ?     All 4K ?  (Duo 4K, Uno 4K/SE, Solo 4K, Ultimo 4K)

Yes, the Duo 4K, Uno 4K/SE, Solo 4K and Ultimo 4K.
But be aware that they do need to have that specific FBC-tuner (the 45308X), because many have been delivered with the 45208 which does not support S2x.
Anyway: I can report MLS working fine on 5W with the 45308X and those new drivers.

Who knows PLS/MIS actually works on the 45208 too, as PLS/MIS is not a specific S2x feature.

 

No, it does not work on 45208 tuners. Delsys has to return FE_CAN_MULTISTREAM. 45208 tuner does not return that.

 

Go in NimSelection screen, highlight tuner, and press info.

 

I've got 45208 in slot 1, and 45308X in slot 2. Works perfect. Receiver selects 45308X to play multistream services. Multistream scan options only show for the capable tuner.

[jpuigs]

Multistream is a way of mixing several DVB streams into one signal.

Frequently, multistream signals are made to carry DVB-T multiplexes (f.i. french, italian channels at 5 West), and it's a way of saving several uplink signals.

Instead of uplinking signals separately to transponders, providers create a multistream signal, which has all streams inside it.

Then, they only have to uplink one multistream signal to satellite, which will have of course more bandwith than a single stream one, but they save using uplinking equipment.

Reception is then easier too, just receiving one DVB-S2 signal from satellite, instead of having several tuners to receive each stream.

 

An example : 12543 H. Eutelsat 5 West

A multistream signal , symbol rate 34200 FEC 8/9, S2-8PSK , carries 4 Telecom Italia Media streams, which are DVB-T signals.

Bitrate for this configuration is about 90 Mbits/s

 

They could use 4 individual streams with a symbol rate of 9-10 Msymb/s each one, which would give 19-24 Mbits/s. x 4.

So, they mix it up in one single Carrier, and they need less receving equipment in DVB-T transmitter locations.

[Huevos]

No, it is simply said a multiplexing mechanism to put multiple channels in a single datastream. I can only assume it has to do with transponder bandwidth saving.

Main use is to package several terrestrial multiplexes onto one satellite transponder. That way they can be unpacked and broadcast without SI tables being inserted locally. NIT table is for terrestrial. Also LCNs are present on 5W transpondrs so it would be possible to create an automatic bouquet.

 

 MIS-example.jpg   428.65KB   13 downloads

Edited by Huevos, 11 May 2019 - 18:39.

[Huevos]

Multistream[...]Reception is then easier too, just receiving one DVB-S2 signal from satellite, instead of having several tuners to receive each stream.

In enigma this is not true. You need one tuner for each input stream you want to receive simultaneously even though both input streams come from the same transponder.

[jpuigs]

yes, of course, it's not true in enigma.

Multistream is not suposed to be received by general public, it's for terrestrial/satellite signal providers who have more profesional equipment than us.

[Erik Slagter]

Exactly. I also think one of the considerations is that using this technique "most users" won't be able to view it, making it into a very cheap encryption. Now many enigma receiver have PLS/MIS tuners, but I assume most "normal" receivers still won't receive it. I am afraid if many receivers will be to receive it, there's going to be a real encryption, which would be a shame. The first services using real encryption already showed up.

[jpuigs]

I am afraid if many receivers will be to receive it, there's going to be a real encryption, which would be a shame. The first services using real encryption already showed up.

 

I'm afraid so too….

[Huevos]

Exactly. [---]. Now many enigma receiver have PLS/MIS tuners, but I assume most "normal" receivers still won't receive it. I am afraid if many receivers will be to receive it, there's going to be a real encryption, which would be a shame. The first services using real encryption already showed up.

There are cheap, non enigma receivers out there that receive it (e.g. Octagon SX88). Channels are only encrypted if they are encrypted on terrestrial, otherwise it would not be possible to use as a secondary (backup) feed for terrestrial transmitters.

[Erik Slagter]

I think it's not even the secondary but the main feed for terrestrial base stations. And why can't they using encryption then? Only if their (main) subscribers have receivers that don't support encryption, which may or may not be the case, who knows.

[40H3X]

https://wiki.openpli...ream_capability

 

I think this is rather outdated?

[Huevos]

I think it's not even the secondary but the main feed for terrestrial base stations. And why can't they using encryption then? Only if their (main) subscribers have receivers that don't support encryption, which may or may not be the case, who knows.

I don't know about where you come from but here terrestrial is a mix of encrypted and not encrypted, mainly not encrypted. And I don't have encryption built into my TV.

[Pr2]

On 5°W French provider on 12648 V you have both crypted and unencrypted broadcasted in MIS.

[Huevos]

On 5°W French provider on 12648 V you have both crypted and unencrypted broadcasted in MIS.

Yes, and those channels that are encrypted are also encrypted on terrestrial.

[Erik Slagter]

Which is kind of a give-away as the source is exactly these MIS/PLS transponders...

 

I found only one (!) encrypted service.

 

As soon as the terrestrial receivers can handle encryption (maybe they already do), there is no technical limitation for encryption of the services on the PLS/MIS transponders.

[Huevos]

Erik, what I am getting at is television sets. Some television sets support CI modules but most don't. No one is going to want to by an additional receiver to attach to their television set when there is a perfectly good tuner already built in. Adding encryption would render the internal tuner of millions of television sets as useless.

[WanWizard]

Afaik MIS/PLS streams are not intended for end-users, so end-user devices don't need to support it.